Sonya: Want to hear about an awkward elevator conversation? And about how many crickets you'll need to feed your sister's 15 chickens? In this episode of Beyond the Page, we're talking to authors Lita and Jean. We'll touch on how the pair is currently doing, how some of their relationships have developed or devolved, and how you could make a difference both locally and globally. Master Wings Publishing, books that inspire, educate, and last.

Sonya: Welcome to the Master Wings Beyond the Page podcast. I'm Sonya Sindberg, Associate Publisher here at Master Wings Publishing. I'm joined by Lita Thomas and her daughter Jean-Marie McNamara, military veterans, co-authors of the award-winning memoir, Lita and Jean: Memoirs of Two Generations of Military Women.

Today, we're continuing the conversation. We're looking at what happened after the book was published. Lita and Jean, I know you talked about how your relationship with each other evolved a little bit, but how did your relationships change or not change as a result of the book?

Lita: Oh, she opened the door.

Jean: Well, like we said, it was a very painful process, you know, going through the writing process, and it took us a long time. Yeah. Also because of the lack of typing skills, but mostly because it was painful.

So, it took us about five years to write. And during that entire time, we kept asking family members and friends, you know, would you like to read it and give us feedback? Because we would really appreciate that. And then I also kind of thought that other people would have impressions of what was going on at the time and be able to provide their perspective as well. And I thought that that would be vital.

Lita: So we opened that door over and over again. But nobody wanted to do it.

Jean: No. We also asked, you know, after it was published. But we also asked, you know, like, do you feel comfortable with us putting this work out under our names so that it is associated with our family? Or do you prefer that we use pseudonyms? And it turns out it wasn't fine.

It just really, it, it changed my perspective on a number of things. But that they that they did not want that truth to be told. And that they were very upset that we would even consider putting in the whole book was how it was truth.

Lita: It was true. And it was we wanted to share our truth.

Jean: And we wanted to, I think the whole everything we included was to show how we got to where we why we both joined the military, what drove us to that decision, and then how our experiences in the military changed us, and how we dealt with the aftermath of a severe injury.

And, you know, now we're still, you know, we're still growing and developing. But you can't be who you are today without who you were before, and who you were yesterday. And unfortunately, our family did not appreciate that.

Even the individuals who I thought we characterize as, I mean, I just I gave like short little blurbs about everyone. Yeah. And I gave very kind little I tried not to be overly critical and give in, you know, put out everyone's dirty laundry or it, you know, express the worst of the worst. But they all took umbrage to it. And basically said, we are not talking to you anymore, until the point at which they needed help. Each.

And then they were like, Oh, Lita is the caregiver. So when someone is in a dire situation, and needs an extraordinary amount of help, obviously, that's still who we turn to.

Sonya: Wow. Lita, How was that for you?

Lita: Yeah, oh, it was, you know what, I forgive and forget pretty quickly, pretty easily. And when somebody came to me and said, you know, one of the relatives said, Can you help me out? Yeah. I'm like, of course.

Because I wouldn't, I would never hold a grudge. It's just not in my character. And it didn't even it didn't even sink in until afterwards, when I kind of got slapped down.

Uh, that people really don't necessarily change, but they might wear a mask in order to accomplish their goals at the time. And I think that's what happened.

Jean: And over and over again, I, she would go and be kind. And I was just like, I don't and I would tell her I don't understand. And, you know, do you not remember this? And she's like, No, I don't remember that. And it's like, but it just happened. And she's like, but they need help. And it's like, I know. You mean like an enemies list? Well, not an enemies list.

But I guess it got to the point where the only reason she stopped helping was to the point where we we basically put ourselves in danger. And then she said, Well, obviously, I need to step back. Because if, if we're, you know, if this is an issue, there's a threat hanging over actual physical issue where we could get hurt, then this isn't the way to go. But you would not believe the, the emotional toll it took on us the financial toll it took on us. How much I mean, months of months.

Sonya: Were there any positive relationships that happened as a result of you writing this book? Did you get to meet any lovely people or things like that?

Jean: Well, I think my mom has an amazing connection with the family of the gentleman she donated a kidney to.

Sonya: Yeah, absolutely.

Jean: And, and I don't think that'll ever change. And I think we've realized how important it is to have relationships with people, you know, with friends, and how friendships can be extraordinarily strong.

Lita: Oh, for sure. Like, I don't know if, if I told you, but my, my husband passed away May 31, a couple of months ago. And it wasn't expected at all. He basically died in my car. And I ended up with a concussion trying to get him out of the car to give him CPR. But he didn't survive. And a friend of mine from the Navy, when I was stationed at Scott Air Force Base, as a logistics officer,

Jean: With a combined military group.

Lita: Right. It was Air Force, Coast Guard, Navy, Marines and Army. So the Navy component, officer, and I, we developed a friendship because we worked together for a couple of years down there. And when she heard that Tony died, her first question was, do you need any help? And I started crying, because people, people that you expect to say things like that, didn't.

Jean: Yeah.

Lita: But she did. And the next day, she was in my living room. She lives in Virginia.

Yeah, she flew right out. Yeah. So yeah, I guess we just, I guess we have decided that friendship can be really, really important.

Jean: And we do have amazing friends. Yeah, for sure. And we've also developed an amazing community with our podcast. And I know we just...

Lita: We lost one of our guests recently, and that was very hard. But her parents felt strong enough about us, and how we helped her hear her story, that she reached out, her mother reached out on Facebook and let me know that, you know, Lauren has passed. Oh, God.

Jean: But we are very grateful for that. Yeah, we have our own communities, I guess. And my, my sister, and her family. I, we’re closer than ever. Yeah. And, and, you know, we're very, very, very grateful for, for them. And she also has all of her critters.

Sonya: Yes, because I'm gonna say, yeah, like, let's maybe tell me about a recent positive experience. Some chicken related information or something.

Jean: The chickens know the sound of my mom's car. Oh, and I think that's all you need to know. So as soon as she pulls up, you can see all the chickens come running, which I think is hilarious.

Sonya: So now how many chickens so people can visualize it properly?

Lita: How many? Oh, I think 15.

Sonya: 15 chickens!

Jean: Oh, yeah. And they were all, you know, like hand reared. And they all have names. And they'll never you know, they're, they're not meat.They're pets. Yeah. All of her animals are pets.

Lita: They're pets that lay eggs. Yeah.

Jean: And she has ones that are have the big floofy, floofy feather covered head. So you have no idea where they're actually staring. Yeah. And and she has all different breeds of chicken. And they yeah, they all know my mom, because she she does tend to bring them treats. And then she recently purchased four sheep. Yes, yep.

Lita: He brought him as he brought him as a lamb and and now they're full size sheep and they come running when Kim goes back there because she's the she's the treat lady.

Jean: Yeah, but she don't know us yet. They said you really have to sit with the sheep before they get to know you. But they are adorable.

Sonya: What kind of treats do you give them?

Lita: I give the chickens crickets. I buy about 2000 - 4000 live crickets.

Jean: And as someone who in kindergarten had someone run up to me with a glass soda pop bottle full of something and dump it down my shirt and then smash it against my chest. And it was crickets. I basically have a panic attack on the two and a half hour drive because she my mother insists on buying the crickets here and then driving with them in the car. And I have informed her on many occasion. If one got any of those crickets get out, I am jumping out.

Sonya: You are also out.

Jean: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yes. But just hearing them. It's so many crickets. And it's so horrifying. And then it's so horrifying to see the chickens eating the crickets. I am anti cricket treats, but they will eat, circle of life. They will eat.

She does have a farm, so she grows, you know, like the Brussels sprouts and tomatoes and watermelon and cabbages. And yeah, that's all fun to watch. And they're all very I was going to say sweet, but they're they're, they're chicken. So they I just know that you can't wear sandals near them.

Lita: Oh, no.

Jean: But they they're very cute. And the sheep are adorable, fluffy little sheep who will eventually get to know us. But and one of them. We're trying to identify the sheep so that we can call them by name.

Yeah. And it's very challenging because they all look like sheep. But my sister knows each one and she knows the chicken.

Yeah. So and then my sister also has a dog. That's is, I believe, although she'll tell me that genetically, it's not true, is a mix between a great Dane and a pit bull. So it's like a baby horse that thinks it's a lap dog. And yes, also absolutely adores my mom and thinks that he is a lap dog that can sit in her lap.

Lita: And he weighs more than me.

Sonya:  So respectful of Lita’s boundaries, it sounds like.

Lita: Oh, yeah. No, no.

Jean: But that's another thing. I mean, I think our pets, even, you know, in times of grief, have been a great comfort. And then we also have, you know, here we have amazing neighbors that, you know, they're also there to help in any way they can.

We have one neighbor who has so many challenges in with her family, with her own health. And yet she's constantly doing little things that make a huge difference in everyone else's life. And we're just constantly inspired by everything that she does.

Sonya: She does one example of a little thing that you could do.

Lita: When she's pulling the garbage cans is what I would forget.

Jean: She'll be doing taking her walk, which is her only hour because she's a full time caregiver for her family and has family members with special needs. For one hour a day where she gets to walk and be by herself, she'll spend bringing neighbors trash cans up their drive and putting them by their houses for them, which is just very thoughtful.

Sonya: There's a community of care.

Jean: Yes, absolutely.

Sonya: Yeah, yeah, that's really lovely.

Jean: Yeah. And the neighbors, the neighbors on the other side of us have two children and one plays soccer enthusiastically. And occasionally his aim is a tad off. We have a number of soccer balls that land in the backyard and we throw them back over the yard. And then he's come to the door with flowers to say thank you for sending all of his soccer balls back over the fence.

Sonya: That's lovely.

Jean: Mm hmm. We are very lucky.

Sonya: Yeah. So should people be worried about you? I guess is the question.

Jean: Like a little bit, a little bit, a little bit, not a lot of bit. It is challenging. My mom goes rather frequently to visit one family member who lives in the state in a very close proximity to my maternal grandmother. So she does occasionally run into other family members. And it's very interesting.

Lita: Awkward

Jean: To say the least, because they're just the comments that they'll make. Like she was recently, you know, was on the elevator and was going to get off the elevator. And one of her brothers was standing there and he said, oh, Tony died, huh? And it's like,

Lita: wow, there you go.

Jean: Wow. Yeah. Yeah, he did.

Sonya: Wow.

Jean: But I guess it's also, you know, we we learn that nobody's perfect and that. You know, you you just have to choose what you want to be in life and, you know, hopefully make a difference and help others. And I think that's the best way to go about things.

Lita: And I took on a brand new challenge this year.

Jean: I'm hoping it's a challenge that I'm already aware of.

Sonya: Please tell me what is your brand new challenge?

Lita: I adopted a school in Kampala, Uganda.

Sonya: OK.

Lita: And I spent six months gathering supplies for the school and filling my garage. And once I had everything gathered up, I learned that I don't know how to pack for overseas shipments. But it was a learning challenge for somebody that ended her career as a logistics officer.

First, first time I ever did it by myself. But I got it all there. It just took about four months more than I expected. And they are now very set up. It's a school of about 150 kids that have either no parents or one parent. And they all live in poverty, in severe poverty.

And a friend of mine on Facebook who is a teacher, retired teacher, he supplied the funds to build the structure of the school. The land was donated. And I supplied everything to fill the school. So they are all doing much better. And I feel better looking at their progress every day on Facebook.

Sonya: Lita, that's so wonderful. Was there something in particular that prompted you to do that?

Lita: The teacher had been posting requests for assistance for maybe, I don't know, maybe a year. I mean, I guess he's been doing it a little bit longer than I thought. He's been requesting assistance for about a year.

I think he was just running on a shoestring and hoping for the best. And I'd notice it every so often. Then all of a sudden, it just kind of hit me like, well, he's not asking for a lot.

You know, he's asking for chalk. I mean, you know, it's just not a big deal. So then I contacted him and I said, well, you know, what would really be ideal for you? And he rattled off a list and I copied it all down.

And the first thing that I bought, which makes all the sense in the world, and Jean would probably be happy if I would have stayed with that kind of shopping. I introduced him to a school book distributor that was in his city. And he didn't have to wait for it. He didn't have to go far. He just went over there and I just paid the bill. And now he's got school books for all the kids.

Sonya: Incredible. Yeah. I'm sure that there's other organizations or individuals that are still in similar need. You know, if someone listening wanted to pursue something similar, is there a route you'd recommend they take?

Jean: I would say, you know, I have one teacher I remember from high school, Dr. Abrahamson. And he always told us that you have to think globally and act locally. And I think doing that can be making a huge world of difference.

So going and finding out what your local school needs is a great place to start. Many teachers have wish lists online. And that's, you know, absolutely fantastic.

And they typically get more donations at the beginning of the school year. But by the middle of the school year, they're also going to need help. So if you have the time and means by which to do that, that's amazing. And not everyone does. But you can also donate, if you don't have the financial means, donating any amount of time.

Lita: Right.

Jean: To any organization. You know, if you deliver, you know, help with organizations like Meals on Wheels, where you deliver food to individuals that might need that or spend time. I know when my mom, well, when my mom and my stepdad, you know, had this very traumatic recent event, there was a chaplain there that volunteers her time at the hospital, who was just there holding her hand and providing comfort and doing something like that.

If you can, you know, organizations like the American Red Cross or, you know, overseas, it's the American Red Crescent or Red Star or Red Diamond. They help individuals here in the United States. You know, if a family has a fire, they're there with blankets.

So maybe, you know, donating if you have extra blankets to organizations that do things like or pet, right. Or donating towels, you know, your old towels to an animal rescue organization. There's an animal rescue organization locally in Naperville that provides foster homes for individuals who are going through traumatic events.

So someone who might be experiencing homelessness or going through a domestic situation and wants to temporarily home their animal until those issues can be resolved. So if you can open up your heart, open up your home in any little bit, even just smiling at someone or saying, you know, good morning, I think it can make a big difference. That's one thing, and this is going to sound really weird, but we spend a lot of time in hospitals.

So I think it's always interesting in civilian hospitals, no one really says anything to anyone. But in veterans hospitals, you'll have at least half of the people you walk by, employees, other patients saying, hi, you know, good morning. How are you? And it is it makes it more congenial and it can lift someone's spirits and it does make a big difference.

So anything you can do on the local level, because not of us, not all of us have the logistical means by which to, you know, send a school basically overseas. Yeah, it's a big undertaking.

Sonya: Yeah, reaching out for connection and in all of these ways. Yeah, absolutely. Beautiful. Thank you so much for coming on with us today and being so vulnerable and sharing your stories and your heart like this.

I know, as we were saying at the beginning, it can be very painful to look at these past experiences, but there's so much that can come out of that, both for you and for others. So it's really meaningful. Thank you.

And if you're in the Chicago area, Lita and Jean: Memoirs of Two Generations of Military Women, the book, and Lita and Jean, the people, will both be available at the Printers Row Lit Fest on Saturday, September 12th. The festival is free. It takes place from 10 to 6 along South Dearborn Street, and it is an incredible opportunity.

You can pick up a copy of Lita and Jean, you can get it signed, you can get some giveaways, and you can explore lots of other books and authors that are wonderful across the literary community. Hope to see you there. And don't forget to follow, subscribe, rate, share the Master Wings Beyond the Page podcast.

And until next time, keep exploring, keep learning, and keep the spirit of storytelling alive.